17 replies to this topic

[Hertta]

About half a year ago I was doing some graphical stuff, nothing big, but something enough to fulfill my needs. Scrollers, plasmas, some primitive bump mapping..

Since then I have done absolutely nothing. Tried to create something new. Mixing different formulas, adding some more variables, new formulas, new, faster drawing functions... Was fun until it lasted.

Right now, after few months of doing nothing, I ahve a desire to do something. But I have no clue what to do. I want to do, but I have nothing to do. I could just get some ideas like making text-based SimCity-clone, or such. Why I am not interested? I don't know.

Now after thinking that question for few minutes, I think it is because it would be waste of time. What would I learn from it? Quite much nothing, dealing with variables and text-mode can not be very hard. Then, I do not want to try anything bigger, as I am 100% sure it will fail eventually. I do not know why. I just forget the projects I seem to be failing on.

Could it be that I have some kind of a fobia for failing at things I start? I have no clue where that kind of "feature" has came from, as I used to learn QuickBASIC years ago just by trying harder and harder projects until I was happy with them.
I used to experiment with new stuff, I was not afraid trying bigger projects. Projects which I could not tell how I do them. Things I had no idea how to do, I tried, I tried again, I failed 2 times, tried once more and succeed.

What I told about the last experiments of mine, with graphics.. I did fail with the bump mapping. Although I got it working somehow, the performance was awful. The whole thing was so unstable, buggy and slow that I just started doing new stuff. Stuff I knew I would not fail on.

So right now I am getting quite pissed at the situation of mine. I want the old moments of joy with coding back! Nothing was so fun than being able to make computer to make weird sounds from PC-speaker when I was 10 years old. Or when I learnt how to use COS and SIN to move some object to some direction when I just gave the velocity and angle where to move it to.

I lack motivation. I have interest to code something, but the lack of motivation just strains me. I can not get anything done.

Maybe a new language? Maybe something else? Anyone else been in the same position? if YOU were me, what would YOU do? What should I do?

Sorry if the post is in the wrong forum or so, if the post is hard to understand or anything else which I should say sorry for someone about.

[karligula]

How long have you been coding? I've been coding for 23 years and I have to say my motivation has gradually reduced over the last few years. Maybe programming might be something I've just grown out of? Or maybe it's the sophistication of today's software that I feel I just can't keep up with?

But I agree keeping motivated on a coding job can be difficult, especially if you're a lone coder. In a team with people around to support you it's not so bad, but on your own, when things get tough, the temptation to just forget about is is a big one.

The only thing I've learned to help motivate myself is just try to focus on one task. Any piece of software is composed of loads of little things to get done, and if you try to think about them all at once it can get overwhelming, even for relatively small jobs. So just one thing at a time helps. Sometimes.

Speaking for myself, I'm going to have a holiday ;-)

[Hertta]

I have been coding 6 or 7 years. I am currently 17 years old, and started with QB when I was 10 or 11.

I believe it could be nice to actually DO something with the code. Right now, it is just some simple stuff which ain't needed. I mean, builders like to build buildings, they do not waste their bricks for something unnecessary and useless.

This could be the problem, with the fobia of failing. I see there is no proper program for something. I start making my own. The half way I realize that I do not know how to continue. I get stuck and the project soon just dies - fail++;

Maybe I am not into new things. Learning new language would be interesting, I started doing some C++ few months ago, but failed AGAIN. Possibly due to lack of time, and the fact that I started the coding with BASIC-language, and I still use BASIC-alike language. The syntax has been burnt to my head so well that anything else just feels impossible. (Though I have been doing PHP for few years, and few scripting languages aswell with no problems)

I could try it again, with some more effort put to it, but first I need the motivation. Though, I believe I would gain it as I advance with the language.

[anubis]

Quote

I believe it could be nice to actually DO something with the code. Right now, it is just some simple stuff which ain't needed. I mean, builders like to build buildings, they do not waste their bricks for something unnecessary and useless.

I think that is plain false. The value of something isn't necessarily given by the use to others. If it has meaning to you it has a value and is worth doing. I will never forget the happiness I felt when I wrote my first software renderer and had the first wireframe cube on the screen. What's the actuall use of that ? Nada. Still I could show to myself that I was able to do it.

As far as motivation is concerned my main drive was always to explore. On the one hand what I can do but on the other also to find out something about the world out there.

I think I especially stuck to games because it opens the possiblity for a narrative in you programm, which always struck me as something special in computer science.

So what I would do is, when you think you fail on something, to take a step back and try to find something just a little bit easier that will help you on your way to your actual goal.

Anyway.. just my two cents...

[Hertta]

anubis said:

I think that is plain false. The value of something isn't necessarily given by the use to others. If it has meaning to you it has a value and is worth doing. I will never forget the happiness I felt when I wrote my first software renderer and had the first wireframe cube on the screen. What's the actuall use of that ? Nada. Still I could show to myself that I was able to do it.

Would taht be the same after you had written the renderer dozen of times before, and been stuck on the same position for years?

Sure I have learnt alot by the experimenting I have done, but the fact that things I have learnt have only been useful in the projects I have already made. I haven't really learn anything new, which would put me on the new "level" on coding. I have mainly been in the beginner state for all these years.

Maybe I just should dump the BASIC-alike languages and learn something new. C++ was interesting, but it seemed a bit frustrating, mostly due to the totally new "environment" and syntax to work on, as I am currently using Linux.

I believe setting some goals for myself would help aswell. I haven't never really liked goals, as it limits the freedom, but it seems without them I will never get to anywhere.

Then again, now it seems I am actually forcing myself to learn something, and forcing ain't that fun, no freedom. Though, I believe learning new language on a completely new system can not be that bad that it shouldn't be tried.

Hopefully I get something done this time.

[anubis]

Yes... I advise you to drop BASIC :)

[SamuraiCrow]

I'd advise against C/C++ as a first language. They have warts that make Basic look like a shining example of goodness. If you're still just frustrated with QuickBasic, you have other options that are much more beginner friendly.

Try switching to Python instead of QuickBasic. There is an extension for it called PyGame that will get you started. There are also OpenGL bindings for it when you're ready to move on to 3D programming.

If you decide to stick with the QuickBasic syntax, check out FreeBasic instead. It has OpenGL bindings as well, which will let you improve the performance of your code dramatically over software rendering.

[karligula]

Well if you've only been coding for 7 years then certainly you shouldn't be bored of it already ;-)

Sound to me more like you don't know what your next step is after learning the basic stuff. In that case I would just pick a simple game like Space Invaders or Sudoku and have a go at implementing that. Personally I would stick with BASIC while doing your first simple project, otherwise you'll be continuously learning new little bits without getting anything finished. Trust me, there's nothing quite like having a finished game that you can point at with pride and say, 'I DID THAT!'

So, try to keep in mind the finished item, how proud you'll be of it, how impressed your friends will be, and just take one step at a time towards that. A simple game shouldn't take more than a few weeks to finish. And once you're done post a link to it on Devmaster so we can all play it and enjoy it. Don't worry about it being simple, we're all here to help.

GO FOR IT!

[Hertta]

SamuraiCrow said:

I'd advise against C/C++ as a first language. They have warts that make Basic look like a shining example of goodness. If you're still just frustrated with QuickBasic, you have other options that are much more beginner friendly.

Try switching to Python instead of QuickBasic. There is an extension for it called PyGame that will get you started. There are also OpenGL bindings for it when you're ready to move on to 3D programming.

If you decide to stick with the QuickBasic syntax, check out FreeBasic instead. It has OpenGL bindings as well, which will let you improve the performance of your code dramatically over software rendering.

FreeBASIC is exactly what I have been using for last 2 years or so.

I have done some PHP, VB6, C#, various scripting languages, QB/FB. Then I have been learning C++ and Python in last 3 months. Python failed due to switching from Linux to Windows, and I was not really interested to continue with it.

Yeah, I see the problem being in the next step. What next? I got tons of ideas what to do with something like VB6, but the language is completely outdated, and ain't really working for Linux.

C++/Python should work flawlessly, and so should FreeBASIC. I just found myself doing some simple C++ once again.

Only thing I wished there was, is IDE with graphical GUI designing capabilities for Linux. I am still avoiding writing the whole GUI-controlling stuff with bare hand. (After VB6, that is. :P)

Well, anyway, I try to keep the interest up, maybe I can get something done this time.

[SamuraiCrow]

I hear that the Code::Blocks IDE is available for both Windows and Linux and costs nothing but download time. It has a GUI builder in the works for wxWidgets. Since you've put several years into "beginners' languages" already, you might be able to handle C++.

The problems with C++ is that most of the freeware cross-platform libraries for it are written in C rather than C++ and you end up having to learn both the "old" method of C programming alongside the "new" way of C++ programming. Not to mention that you have to adhere to some programming "style" guidelines to maintain readability of your code. (No variable assignments or post/pre-increment/decrements inside an expression, etc.)

If you want to learn object-oriented C++ without the old C libraries, one new C++ cross-platform game and multimedia library is Simple Fast Multimedia Layer. Of course you'll have to learn the basics of C++ first. There are several freely downloadable books such as How to Think Like a Computer Scientist: C++ Version if you need it.

[Hertta]

I used Code::Blocks for doing C++ and SDL with Windows few months ago.

Handling C++ is alot different. as you said, it requires doing stuff in a different way. Object-Oriented programming? "I just want to do it as I have done it always before!" "Pointers? Why? :|"

It is like learning everything in different way. I believe handling C++ ain't that hard really, but the motivation.. here it comes again! But at least I think the C++ is worth a try.

[karligula]

You could always try the .NET SDK, that has Visual Basic available, and also csharp and c++ for when you're ready for that step. And lots of built in classes for handling Windows, simple graphics, etc. You could also use Visual Basic for most of the code, since you're familiar with that language, and plug in sections of csharp and c++ as you learn them and get more proficient, since all the languages are interoperable within .NET. And very importantly... it's free!

[Hertta]

Free, but not so cross-platform'ish. Though, there is MONO for Linux, which should be quite much same as .NET framwork for Windows.

I tried C# around a year ago, but the constant system.bla.bla.bla.bla.math.bla.bla.multiply.bla.bla(x) drove me crazy. Though, they can be "defined" AFAIK, and it ain't that frustrating once one gets used to it.

Edit: I had some problems getting Anjuta working properly (Missing libraries), Code::Blocks seemed to be a bit outdated, and I could not even get it running.

So, I just installed MonoDevelop and hopefully can get some .NET stuff done. May the C++ come along with .NET stuff, or later.

[kaos]

Hopefully this would help your the motivation : http://gpwiki.org/fo...der=asc&start=0

[anubis]

Quote

So, I just installed MonoDevelop and hopefully can get some .NET stuff done. May the C++ come along with .NET stuff, or later.

I have a virtualized XP installation, just to run my student version of visual studio :) Regarding C# support you just can't beat the Microsoft tools. The IDE is plainly brilliant and this comes from a guy who holds emacs dear for everything c related. They more or less have created a system that isso good at predicting what I want to type, that half of my C# coding consist of hitting some completion key.

Two major setbacks though... You diminish your abbility to remember longish variable names and you become pretty lazy regarding manual type checks, since the IDE usually knows what type you want and suggests the right variable to you.

After more than a decade of c/c++ however, you start to feel enitled to these goodies:)

[Hertta]

I believe I am developing fairly well with the C++. C# is quite much dropped due to lack of RAM to run MonoDevelop, though 512MB should be enough, it seems to be VERY slow at times, thus forcing me to stick with the C++.

Anyway, I have had some "winner"-feelings after being able to do something with the foreign language, by my own. I believe this is really raising up the motivation. Atleast now I am eager to learn more and more of C++, and soon SDL, I think.

[karligula]

Well done on the C++ front my friend! There's nothing quite like having a bit of success to feel like you're getting somewhere. You have to gradually build up your confidence whenever you try anything new.

I remember when I moved from assember to C... at first I was programming it like assembler, counting bytes and such like, not really getting C in my head, if you see what I mean. With the result that it was very frustrating and I felt like packing it in. But after a while C suddenly clicked and I found myself feeling quite pleased that I'd conquered it.

It's a good feeling knowing you've mastered something! Now keep going with it and build on your success!

[Hertta]

Yeah, next step would be learning the standard library, along with reading the How to think like a computer scientist, c++ version. It really seems to be valuable resource for me. And as I said in last reply, SDL may come in near future (few weeks, somewhere in October I believe.)