21 replies to this topic

[fireside]

What do you think now that the prices are out? I think PS4 is looking like a better deal. I know Microsoft has kinect and voice, but not sure people will think it's worth an extra 100 dollars.

http://reviews.cnet....-playstation-4/

[Reedbeta]

Microsoft definitely has egg on its face with the higher price and the more restrictive DRM. Personally I'm not at all interested in the Kinect and the voice control stuff, so the PS4 is the clear winner for me. Granted, I did work at Sony so I'm biased...but it would still be the clear winner even if that wasn't the case.

[touch_the_sky]

According to this article not only is the PS4 cheaper but it's also supposed to come out sooner (Holiday as in summer right?) - can't be good for Xbox unless PS4 is launched with some critical flaw and the first batches are a miserable failure.

Also, just when I started digging them new consoles a bit, thanks to all the buzz around... I saw this. Well, I know which toy gets my money first I suppose:)

[Sol_HSA]

Please don't call xbone "xbox1", it's confusing.

[tyree]

microsoft may be transitioning out of the game business. at the very least there making it less of a focal point of the system

[TheNut]

There's quite a bit of chatter that PS4 is the "winner". I think MS shot themselves in the foot with the always online requirement and resale of used games. I mean, Sony recognized that and quickly capitalized. The views just speak volumes and MS has to go on serious damage control. Windows Phone, Windows 8, and now Xbox One? It's just one bad PR after the next.

On the flip side, by targeting television they open themselves up to more markets. Gamers don't care, they just want awesomeness. However, selling XBox One as set-top packages from Comcast, Time Warner, etc. will net them mega sales. Families will see that as a logical choice. The fact that it does games on the side and does them well is just a bonus. All MS has to do is reverse their DRM policy and offer different packages to lower pricing like one model without kinect for $100 off. And let's be serious, it doesn't have to be required. If they do that, it will restore the balance and calm the masses. If they don't, I think it's a pretty clear indicator what will happen.

[Sol_HSA]

I really doubt ms is going to change it's path drastically. It's hard for huge companies to admit they're wrong, and the decisions they've made are also tied to lots of contracts.

The DRM stuff - they've probably into lots of contracts with big publishers and retailers about that, so changing it is unlikely.
Stripping kinect from the box is also very unlikely; kinect as standard is a pretty defining characteristic of the xbone. And the voice control and gestures are "teh future" feature..

And to be honest, lots of people will buy in regardless.

The way I've understood it, microsoft's company culture is such that they don't really see outside the box all that much. "Good for the world" in their mindset equals "good for microsoft", and all that.

I don't know about winphone sales figures, but what option do most people have than to buy the latest version of windows, regardless of how horrible it is? Move to mac? Move to linux? XP is at the end of it's road soon, and some article reported 40-50% of business still running XP..

[TheNut]

Perhaps some companies (shareholders) nudged Microsoft for some asinine DRM policy, but that really has nothing to do with the studios. As MS said, it's entirely up to the studio if they want to enforce it. MS has already protected its bacon by shifting the blame elsewhere. However, gamers don't care. A negative is a negative and that's enough to cause bad PR and they're getting tons of it right now. Will that effect sales figures? Perhaps. I've already seen plenty of community chatter amongst "loyal" XBox 360 fans going turncoat. Many buddies of mine have been echoing the same reasons. It's obviously not a good start for Microsoft when previous owners are already considering jumping ship.

I also don't think my reasons are not obtainable. Let game studios manage their own DRM just as they are today. This will clear Microsoft's name and restore order. If a company wants to use online registration, its their reputation on the line. MS does not need to do anyone any favours by implementing the framework for them. Kinect is also not a necessary piece of equipment. There's a foolish requirement to have it physically plugged, but you can disable the device via settings. Remove the hardware plug requirement and you're done. It in itself adds more negative PR as there's already conspiracies floating around the web that this is a secret FBI/CIA/NSA/SS/HS/FEMA plot to spy on people. Given the recent whistleblowing, it's a pretty hot topic.

[Stainless]

The way we do DRM in AGP is a bit different.

You register devices separately from games, it's free to register a device. Then when you buy a game, it works on all your devices.

You can also "lend" your games to friends, they can play it on your DRM as long as their device is connected to yours.

Once they break the connection, the game goes back to un-licensed state. This usually means you get a crippled version but can still play it.

I'm sure we could sell it to Microsoft if they ask nicely...... nah let them suffer

[Sol_HSA]

The microsoft response is pretty much like I expected:
http://www.escapistm...-One-Negativity

tl;dr: we're right, we don't care what people say.

[Stainless]

What did you expect? Microshaft to be sensible? You know better than that by now

What I don't get is how a machine that sells at say $300 comes over to the UK and sells for £300. I know the exchange rate fluctuates but that's extracting the urine.

[WDR]

@Stainless: Yeah, tell me about it. The Xbox 360 currently is around $250 in US, I guess. Which in conversion is like around Rs. 13,000 here in India. Locally, it sells for Rs. 25,500 - Almost DOUBLE the price. The PS4 is slated for $400, I think. In conversion, I guess that is around Rs. 24,000. Locally - Rs. 40,000. Why the huge differences I don't get!

[Sol_HSA]

At least they're using usd-eur 1:1 conversion, unlike adobe, who basically reverse the currency rate..

[rouncer]

Australias the same, it doesnt matter how much the moneys worth, as soon as it gets to australian dollars they like to up the price... maybe that fact is why AUD and english money stays at such a high price? I dont know much about economics, it always shafted me... same goes for drugs, american speed is worth 3 times less as it costs in Australia, although the currency is about equal value. hehe

Just means australian and english corporations fetch more money out of their consumers (even drug dealers?) than american ones do... how would this effect things?
Youd better hope Obama knows what hes doing.

[EDIT] theres more competition for sales in america? and I read in india you have a similar problem with console prices... [/EDIT]

[WDR]

Does shipping really cost that much? I thought some of the major countries had a local manufacturing unit.

@rouncer: All electronics in India are expensive (except desktops, for some reason). Most people get their electronics from the UK or the US via some family or relatives living there. As for consoles, they are also bought the same way. The ones from UK are fine, as they share the same region encoding. The ones from US, however, are brought here and modchipped in order to remove the PAL/NTSC encoding. That just voids the warranty and messes up the hardware. But... what can you do?

[fireside]

Quote

All electronics in India are expensive (except desktops, for some reason). Most people get their electronics from the UK or the US via some family or relatives living there.

That just about has to be government tampering with prices. If things are screwed up with prices, it's almost always because of the government. Most of them hate imports, which is stupid, because free flowing trade leads to better business for everyone.

[WDR]

Oh yeah... Did I mention that India has the worst government despite being known as one of the best democracies in the world? I guess I forgot to mention that. I know... The statement is pretty ironic.

I don't want to go off-topic here, but we have like the highest fuel prices. Don't know the exact rates, but we buy from the Middle East at about Rs.15/litre. That sells for about Rs.70/litre by the time it reaches consumers. Seriously flawed.

[fireside]

Yeah, it never fails that the worst possible candidates for government jobs end up with them. They're all totally anal retentive and don't have any idea how economics really work. Just be thankful you don't live in North Korea, I guess. How'd you like to have that nut job running things?

[WDR]

Hahaha... You just made me realize how grateful I should be for living in a democracy.
Anyways, back on topic... My choice is PS4. Microsoft just lost the last bit of trust I had in them. W8 and now this.

[TheNut]

It looks like Microsoft felt the full force of the gaming community and decided to back down on the always online DRM and used game trading. They're half way there. Now they just have to lower the price and offer a temporary (pre-order) bundle package at loss to truly apologize to the gaming community and restore their popularity.

Cave Johnson said:

All right, I've been thinking. When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back! Get mad! I don't want your damn lemons, what am I supposed to do with these? Demand to see life's manager!