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davepermen 101 Feb 03, 2003 at 13:21

best is to know all of them, and love and hate all of them. both have great features, and both have stuff wich is really messy. so what? gl is great, dx is great, c is great, c++ is great, c# is great, too.. tons of other stuff as well..

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davepermen 101 Feb 03, 2003 at 13:19

gl is just a helper library wich unifies interface to graphics cards. like sdl a helper library wich makes crossplatform 2d coding possible.. etc.. (gl is great, nontheless)

about gl2. there are tons around asking when gl2 is finally there, not realizing that parts of gl2 are yet here, the new extensions wich come out by the arb are all based on fitting gl2 later. there will never be a “now gl2 is there” release date.. vendors will more and more support some features of gl2. and one day, we have all the features of gl2. high level shading language for example is possibly only a month away from its birth on the ati radeon9700pro. sure, with restrictions, but still useable to play first time with it.

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davepermen 101 Feb 03, 2003 at 13:16

and then there is openAL, similar to opengl in usage.. i think.. haven’t tried it, but a friend of mine is very happy with it

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davepermen 101 Feb 03, 2003 at 13:15

yes, you can render to a texture with ogl, but currently over the extensions
WGL_ARB_pbuffer
WGL_ARB_pixel_format (or something like that)
and
WGL_ARB_render_texture..

that means quite complex, and messy, and windows only.

why is my target audience multiplatform? all i know do have windows..

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donBerto 101 Feb 03, 2003 at 10:23

gl is just another helper library actually..

careful…

about gl2. it will not come as a big release with huge download (like each dx release for example), but step by step.

you make it sound like OpenGL is competing for bigger releases and faster release dates. opengl is just a standard that many of the gfx card makers support. the architecture review board only meets ever so often that to get a sensible release plan they split it up in point releases like 1.7, 1.8, etc.

dx may be backed by a huge corporation but i imagine whoever heads the dx department is much smaller than the ARB. what does that mean? less people deciding what to do (with their own agendas), the faster things will get done. people at ms are payed to get do this kind of work. it cost companies money to send a representative to go to a review board. that’s my view on it anyway.

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donBerto 101 Feb 03, 2003 at 09:54

i don’t know how strong your programming skills are but here are 2 cool sound-programming libraries that rock!

http://www.fmod.org
http://www.libsdl.org

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donBerto 101 Feb 03, 2003 at 09:47

@davepermen

crossplatform means nothing for me, but its a nice addon.
(and crossplatform means nothing to me, too, because i want to use rendertexture, and that is not crossplatform on gl eighter.. but it looks like a real version is comming (hope))

i’m a little confused. dx and ogl are very similar and they draw nearly equal in power (although many of us can pick through the pros and cons of both). for a person who’s target audience uses a variety of other operating systems then cross-platform development is a key element to consider. it would suck having to write the same code over and over again for different platforms. it’s more than just a “nice addon”.

second, what do you mean by rendertexture? you know you can render to a texture with OpenGL right?

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woz1010 101 Feb 03, 2003 at 06:07

woz1010: will C3 run on any platform then?

If we stick with the Auran Jet engine for C3, then no, not in the near future.
If we go with Torque, then yes.

Right now we are giving Jet a serious run through, just a lot has to be implemented as it is more a generic do anything you want if you extended it type API. But we will have the game servers able to run on Windows and Linux

In response to Good OGL books
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donBerto 101 Feb 03, 2003 at 00:50

agreed. opengl game programming was my first book and though it was really helpful, i realized later that it did leave out a lot of important stuff.

In response to Good OGL books
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void 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 23:46

Imgo openGL game programming isnt that good, it skips alot of material… I think that first you should read Realtime REndering 2nd Edition, best graphics book ive read… And then you should probably read either openGL Game Programming or read some of NeHe’s tutorials. I think that the openGL Reference books such as the red and blue books are more like reference material, not read from cover to cover material.

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davepermen 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 23:43

the helper library (aka devil in the case of images) is not stupid at all, and the way there should be much more. gl is just another helper library actually.. and they work all together..

about gl2. it will not come as a big release with huge download (like each dx release for example), but step by step. we now have tons of new extensions for newest pixelshading stuff in gl, VAO is comming to ARB, rendertexture is comming to ARB, etc.. thats all because of gl2, it made vendors work together again. and they will bit by bit implement gl2 extensions till we have all components in the way they are designed in gl2.

till gl2, we have gl1.5,1.6,1.7… you get the idea:D

and the shader language is yet there, ati works at a compiler for ARB_fragment_program..

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void 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 23:39

Guys, having a helper library that loads various picture and mesh formats for opengl would be STUPID. openGL is a graphics library, nothing else, it doesnt even have the ability to open a window on its own. If you want a helper library, download something like DevIL for image loading, and im sure you can easily find some free code for loading any 3D model format. What I want to see next in OpenGL is OpenGL2.0, when the f**k is it coming out??!! :-)

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davepermen 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 21:47

lets hope so.. would be cool..

In response to structure design help
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davepermen 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 21:42

you can be..

btw, your fontrendering.. dunno.. here it looks awesome.. but i bet its partially because of the fsaa6x on my ati radeon9700pro, isn’t it?:D

In response to OpenGL Performance...
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davepermen 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 21:41

great

nice avatar btw

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baldurk 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 19:35

woz1010: will C3 run on any platform then?

In response to structure design help
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baldurk 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 19:19

Yeh, I’m quite proud of it.

In response to OpenGL Performance...
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SpaCe 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 19:04

Well , I discovered the problem , I had on my computer a software that used in a way NetMeeting…The combination between the two fucked up my GC…Now , after I uninstalled that software , everything is OK :D

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woz1010 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 18:17

I have found myself doing cross platform coding at work recently.
That is code running between different Unix platforms such as SUN, AIX, DEC, True64.

The differences can be plenty and subtle, but they are there in abundance. This is complicated by the fact that it was a decision long ago to use the particular platforms native compiler, not just one like gcc.
Some of the other similar products, like the one I am on, also have a version for windows.

Finally, just a few days ago, I grabbed the opportunity to get the product to build and work on RedHat Linux, so work is sort of interesting for awhile.

As for games:
C3, the game project I am on, was considering using the Torque engine, which is cross platform ready for Windows, Linux, and Mac.

In response to Game Theory
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woz1010 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 18:02

Perhaps the tutorial at Game Tutorials may help.

http://www.gametutorials.com/Tutorials/ope…/OpenGL_Pg4.htm

4th tutorial down on the page.

In response to OpenGL Performance...
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woz1010 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 17:55

Strange that NetMeeting would be a problem.

I ran it last Friday, and went through the setup dialogs, and at the end of it all it informed me that all NetMeeting functionality has been replaced by MSN Messenger services. Thus NetMeeting is no more.

In response to OpenGL Performance...
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davepermen 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 17:48

normally, netmeeting is not to uninstall. and normally, it should not cause your problems (as it is possibly installed, yes, but normally never runs, no..)

to uninstall it, you have to check some of the fancy pc magacines (or their web-equivalents). a longer time ago, i’ve read in one or two of them, how to get windows to show up own software in the software dialog, available to uninstall..

In response to OpenGL Performance...
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SpaCe 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 17:37

Guys , I didnt know where to post this problem…But can someone tell me how to uninstall NetMeeting? Its fucking my GC…This was the cause of my problem , and now I dunno how to uninstall it.

In response to Game Theory
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donBerto 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 17:04

looked up what i could about quarternions [still looking]. anybody got any good links?

In response to structure design help
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davepermen 101 Feb 02, 2003 at 16:43

cute demo

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